Legislature(2007 - 2008)BARNES 124
03/12/2007 01:00 PM House RESOURCES
| Audio | Topic |
|---|---|
| Start | |
| HB137 | |
| HB149 | |
| HB165 | |
| Adjourn |
* first hearing in first committee of referral
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
| + | HB 137 | TELECONFERENCED | |
| *+ | HB 149 | TELECONFERENCED | |
| *+ | HB 165 | TELECONFERENCED | |
| + | TELECONFERENCED |
HB 137-SENIOR FISHING/HUNTING/TRAPPING LICENSES 1:04:20 PM CO-CHAIR JOHNSON announced that the first order of business would be HOUSE BILL NO. 137, "An Act amending the requirements for the identification card needed for sport fishing, hunting, and trapping without a license by residents who are 60 years of age or more." 1:06:35 PM REPRESENTATIVE PAUL SEATON spoke as chair of the House Special Committee on Fisheries, sponsor of HB 137. He explained that a problem was identified in Alaska state statutes whereby a permanent identification card (PID) is given to any person over 60 who applies for one. This PID serves as a lifetime free-of- charge sport fishing, hunting, and trapping license. About 46,000 PIDs have been issued to date. However, the problem is that people move out of the state and yet retain their PID. The Alaska Department of Fish & Game (ADF&G) has noticed problems with people not supporting Alaska's fisheries by buying a fishing license. This bill converts a PID into a free-of-charge temporary identification card (TID) that is good for a three- year period. The TID is tied to the Permanent Fund Dividend (PFD) for determining eligibility. Each year the Permanent Fund Dividend Division will provide ADF&G with an electronic list of every person who received a PFD the previous year. By checking the PFD list, ADF&G can determine an applicant's eligibility for a TID. Alaska residents who do not participate in the PFD program for philosophical reasons can still receive a TID by showing proof to ADF&G that they were in the state for 185 days of the previous year. The TID rewards the senior citizens of Alaska who remain residents of the state. 1:10:02 PM CO-CHAIR GATTO stated that his understanding of the bill is that everyone who currently has a PID will get to keep it, but that new applicants can keep [their TIDs] only if they stay [Alaska residents]. REPRESENTATIVE SEATON stated that this is correct. He asked that the committee adopt the committee substitute (CS) because it incorporates changes requested by ADF&G for clarification purposes. 1:10:52 PM REPRESENTATIVE WILSON moved to adopt as the working document committee substitute (CS) for HB 137, Version 25-LS0118\O, Kane, 3/7/07. 1:11:10 PM CO-CHAIR JOHNSON objected for discussion purposes and asked for confirmation on whether only new applicants will be subject to the [TID] system. REPRESENTATIVE SEATON advised that this is correct. He directed attention to a 2/27/07 opinion from Brian Kane of Legislative Legal Services that confirms that this change is legal. [The committee treated Co-Chair Johnson's objection as being withdrawn. There being no further objection, Version O was treated as before the committee.] 1:12:24 PM CO-CHAIR GATTO asked whether non-resident seniors returning to Alaska to fish are taking a disproportionate amount of fish so as to make the bill's provisions worth the effort. REPRESENTATIVE SEATON responded that the program has developed a bad name and it should not be this way. He explained that there is no requirement to prove anything, an applicant does not even have to submit a driver's license. Cardholders are required to maintain residency, yet there is no way for an officer in the field to verify the person's residency. He expressed his belief that many people who are no longer residents will still return to Alaska to fish even if they must pay for nonresident fishing licenses. Additionally, even if a person leaves the state, he or she will still have a 3-year license. He stressed that the current program is unenforceable and that HB 137 will correct this problem. He also pointed out that the state relies on fishing licenses for funding the monitoring and management of fisheries by the Division of Sport Fish. 1:15:30 PM REPRESENTATIVE WILSON inquired about the results of the 3/7/07 arraignment of the out-of-state couple who was cited in Hoonah for unlawful sport fishing. KATIE SHOWS, Staff to Representative Paul Seaton, said that she thinks the couple was reprimanded for this one particular case. REPRESENTATIVE WILSON asked whether it was correct that the couple had been fishing unlawfully since 2000 and was the couple fined. MS. SHOWS responded that she will ask ADF&G. 1:16:42 PM CO-CHAIR GATTO commented that this is an attack on seniors and questioned whether it is an issue that needs fixing because it generates so little revenue. MS. SHOWS referred to a fact sheet in the committee packet with ADF&G's "best guess" estimate that the revenue lost due to this problem is $137,827. She agreed that this is not a huge sum of money, but that it is something. CO-CHAIR GATTO inquired whether this assumes that everyone who would qualify would still want to fish even though they would now have to pay. MS. SHOWS deferred to Kristin Wright of ADF&G. 1:18:58 PM REPRESENTATIVE ROSES expressed his opinion that this is an equitability issue, not an economic issue, because the benefit of residency for senior citizens is diluted by allowing former residents to [fish for free]. 1:21:03 PM REPRESENTATIVE GUTTENBERG asked whether thought was given to other ways of determining eligibility rather than receipt of a PFD. REPRESENTATIVE SEATON pointed out that using the PFD database to verify eligibility is easy and simple, plus the database is updated every year. If someone did not get a PFD for philosophical reasons there are still ways for them to get a TID. He explained that using a driver's license for eligibility is difficult because some states mandate that a person get a driver's license for that state if he or she lives there for a certain length of time during the year, even if the person maintains residency in another state. 1:24:13 PM REPRESENTATIVE GUTTENBERG stated that it is his understanding that the PFD database is no longer available to the public. He asked how stores selling the licenses access the database will. KRISTIN WRIGHT, Accountant IV, Finance/Licensing Supervisor, Division of Administrative Services, Alaska Department of Fish & Game (ADF&G), explained that the license database will be housed at ADF&G and will not be public. She said that PIDs are not currently available through stores. Applicants must come to an ADF&G office or field office and the PFD database will then be accessed by ADF&G through the Internet. If the applicant's name is not on the PFD database, he or she will be required to fill out a form. In response to a further question, Ms. Wright noted that there are many field offices located throughout the state - Bethel, Tok, Dillingham, Nome, Kotzebue, and Barrow, to name a few. She said that more than 75 percent of current cardholders applied for their PIDs by mail. 1:26:03 PM REPRESENTATIVE EDGMON said he agreed that this is an equitability issue and that it is good public policy. Nonetheless, he said that he is concerned this will be problematic for elderly Alaska natives living in the Bush who will now have to get a new license every three years. MS. WRIGHT advised that she put in a fiscal note to enable ADF&G to notify cardholders well in advance of when their three years is up. A form will be included in the notice for cardholders to fill out and return. In response to a further question, she noted that it is currently too difficult to conduct the application and renewal process over the Internet, but that it might become available in the future. In response to additional questions, Ms. Wright pointed out that a first-time applicant can choose to apply either by mail or in person at a field office or at her [Juneau] office. She noted that renewals could also be done either by mail or in person, and that ADF&G would again verify whether the person had received a PFD or had completed a form with all of the boxes checked off. 1:29:50 PM CO-CHAIR GATTO asked whether an Alaska "snowbird" with an Arizona driver's license would be precluded from getting an identification card under either the current or new system. MS. WRIGHT said that, currently, identification does not have to be presented to receive a PID - an applicant only fills out a form that also includes information about his or her driver's license. While an Arizona license would be a red flag, ADF&G would still issue the card and then send the applicant's name to the Alaska Bureau of Wildlife Enforcement for further checking since ADF&G is not an enforcement agency. This procedure would also apply to the TID program proposed by HB 137. The new system would be more foolproof than the current program because a person must qualify for the PFD and cannot just walk in off the street to avoid paying the [out-of-state] license fee. In response to a further question, Ms. Wright clarified that under the new system, ADF&G would not issue a TID without first looking for the applicant's name in the PFD database. The current system does not require any proof of residence except for the applicant's signature on a line. 1:33:16 PM REPRESENTATIVE GUTTENBERG inquired as to how Ms. Wright built her assumptions regarding who is and who is not eligible, and how many bad licenses were issued each year. MS. WRIGHT stated that she did not have an assumption regarding how many bad licenses have been issued because ADF&G does not believe the abuse is rampant, only that it is a problem. She commented that ADF&G would like to use this license file for sport fishing surveys and would therefore like this file to be accurate for statistical reasons. She said that she included in her analysis the number of licenses issued annually and then assumed that 50 percent of those people would continue to get a fishing license and 25 percent would get a hunting license. She used this assumption because that is what the rest of the population does. In response to a further question, she confirmed that [the percentages] are only an assumption because there is no way to know for sure. 1:35:17 PM REPRESENTATIVE EDGMON asked what Ms. Wright thinks about implementing a five year period instead of a three year period. MS. WRIGHT advised that five years would give a bit more time for people to continue using the TID and that it would be less of an administrative burden. There would be a few more abuses by going with five years, but not a lot. REPRESENTATIVE EDGMON stated his opinion that this is a sensitive issue for senior citizens who already have this card in place. He requested that a five year time period be considered. REPRESENTATIVE SEATON explained that any person already possessing a PID is grandfathered into the program and will never need to re-apply. It is only those seniors receiving cards under the new program who will be affected by the three- year time period. 1:38:08 PM CO-CHAIR JOHNSON closed public testimony after ascertaining that no one else wished to speak. 1:38:35 PM REPRESENTATIVE WILSON commented that she did not think any senior citizen can complain because for the price of a stamp he or she can fish for free for three years. 1:38:58 PM CO-CHAIR GATTO asked whether the Association for the Advancement of Retired Persons (AARP) has commented on the bill. MS. SHOWS reported that Representative Seaton did not contact AARP, nor has he heard from them. She said that only two public comments have been received and that they are in the committee packet - one is the e-mail cited by Representative Wilson regarding the Hoonah couple and the other is an e-mail in opposition to the bill from a senior in District 35. 1:41:04 PM CO-CHAIR GATTO pointed out that the fiscal note for ADF&G constitutes only a couple of thousand dollars in the out years. 1:41:21 PM REPRESENTATIVE WILSON moved to report the CS for HB 137, Version 25-LS0118\O, out of committee with individual recommendations and the accompanying fiscal notes. There being no objection, CSHB 137(RES) was reported from the House Resources Standing Committee.
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